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Did you know?
Introduction and rules
IntroductionWP:DYK
General discussionWT:DYK
GuidelinesWP:DYKCRIT
Reviewer instructionsWP:DYKRI
Nominations
Nominate an articleWP:DYKCNN
Awaiting approvalWP:DYKN
ApprovedWP:DYKNA
April 1 hooksWP:DYKAPRIL
Holding areaWP:SOHA
Preparation
Preps and queuesT:DYK/Q
Prepper instructionsWP:DYKPBI
Admin instructionsWP:DYKAI
Main Page errorsWP:ERRORS
History
StatisticsWP:DYKSTATS
Archived setsWP:DYKA
Just for fun
Monthly wrapsWP:DYKW
AwardsWP:DYKAWARDS
UserboxesWP:DYKUBX
Hall of FameWP:DYK/HoF
List of users ...
... by nominationsWP:DYKNC
... by promotionsWP:DYKPC
Administrative
Scripts and botsWP:DYKSB
On the Main Page
Main Page errorsWP:ERRORS
To ping the DYK admins{{DYK admins}}
Shortcut

This is where the Did you know section on the main page, its policies, and its processes can be discussed.

Are we really not on mobile?

Tracked in Phabricator
Task T360689
Tracked in Phabricator
Task T221993

According to WP:VPR#There is already a different Main Page on the app, DYK isn't on the mobile app main page. I don't use the mobile app, so I have no clue if this is true or not, but @JPxG felt "someone" should let DYK know, so I'm doing that. RoySmith (talk) 15:40, 21 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I can confirm that there is no DYK on the Android app. From the top, the order of Main Page sections is:
  • TFA
  • "Today on Wikipedia" (small body text hyperlink to the normal Main Page)
  • "Top Read" (presumably the articles with the most pageviews in the last day or couple days)
  • PoTD
  • "Because you read" (related articles to one that I was looking at last time I had the app open)
  • ITN
  • OTD
  • "Random article"
  • "Suggested edits"
  • then it loops back to the previous day's TFA.
jp×g🗯️ 17:17, 21 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Similar on Apple devices. If I had to guess, our occasional twelve-hour periods are rather annoying to deal with for a page that is structured on a day-by-day basis. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 17:55, 21 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@The wub told me a while ago not to worry because mobile app uptake is so poor anyway. Cielquiparle (talk) 19:33, 24 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The mobile apps (iOS and Android combined) made up 2.3% of pageviews on English Wikipedia last year [1]. Mobile web was 65.5%, and desktop was 32.2%. That said, the app audiences are slowly growing, and it would be nice to have DYK shown to them as well. the wub "?!" 00:25, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Which is bizarre, since the website version on the phone has a DYK section. Bremps... 11:50, 30 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Sometime back, I had a chance to engage with the WMF team that was building the iOS app. I was making a case for WP:ITNRD and WP:DYK be added to the iOS app. I was not successful. Ktin (talk) 02:01, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Btw, I have a random hypothesis, as follows. The homepage of the iOS app versus the mainpage of the mobile / desktop site as a percentage of views in that category will be a closer comparison than 2.5%: 65.5%: 32.2%. My hypothesis is more app users start their app journey with the app homescreen (mainpage equivalent) compared to mobile / desktop users starting their journey with the mobile / desktop mainpage. Ktin (talk) 02:22, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
MediaWiki Thread that I had started sometime back. Ktin (talk) 02:05, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Tagging @Julle:, who was helpful the last time by connecting me with the iOS app product manager. It seems like the product manager may no longer be with WMF. Ktin (talk) 02:15, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I've pinged ARamadan-WMF, who should be able to get you the right answers. /Julle (talk) 08:32, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you, @Julle, for pinging; hello all, this is Amal Ramadan, I am the senior community relations specialist supporting the mobile applications team in the foundation; we have noticed this request T360689 and it's on our list as we plan work for this coming year.
Also tagging @JTanner (WMF), the Lead Product Manager for the Apps team, for further updates. ARamadan-WMF (talk) 08:24, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

April Fools'

I've started to fill out Prep 1, which will be the April Fool's set. I've moved what I see as the best nominations at WP:DYKAPRIL there already; I think those remaining at DYKAPRIL might need a bit of work, considering they can't all fit.

Or in other words, do you want a dog or a cat in the picture slot? ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 17:28, 22 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Of course, new nominations are still equally welcome. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 17:39, 22 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
That cat image is brilliant, I say go with that. There was a suggestion by Theleekycauldron at the article's nom that ur mum should be lowercase and unquoted?--Launchballer (talk) 17:47, 22 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
i've gone ahead and done it, hopefully it isn't shooting myself in the foot :) theleekycauldron (talk • she/her) 06:06, 23 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
No way, cat! The dog is fantastic. Wrongly accused—paw prints and mugshot taken—slammed into chokey for life—and then, as if things couldn't get any worse, put on diet! "Help!" sez Pep :) ——Serial Number 54129 17:57, 22 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Definitely the dog for mine. Great, eye-catching hook, whereas the cat hooks are quite clunky or else not very April Fools-ish. Gatoclass (talk) 03:13, 23 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I'm inclined toward the dog. Kudos to the maker of the ray cat image, but I think the article about Pep is more appealing both as a hook (it's concise, amusing, and attention-drawing) and as an image (although the bad lighting is a little unfortunate, it still registers strongly as a mug shot, resulting in further amusement because now the reader's thinking, "wait, did they really arrest a dog?). P-Makoto (she/her) (talk) P-Makoto (she/her) (talk) 03:37, 23 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I've realised I never said it here, but I, too, prefer Monsieur Woof. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 08:37, 23 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Pawsing for thought... it's a shame we can't use Eastern State Pawitentiary too  :) ——Serial Number 54129 19:23, 23 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
And the winner iiiiiiisssssss... a bridge? – Hilst [talk] 18:55, 24 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Looks like I mucked up the set- blissfully unaware of the date. When we open a new prep I will move out the offending hooks or another editor can. I moved out the image and will need to move two more. I realize that I have also overloaded Prep 6 with US-centric hooks and that will need to be corrected. Bruxton (talk) 19:34, 24 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Are we really doing 10-hook sets? RoySmith (talk) 19:46, 24 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@RoySmith: I did not set up the ten set, but I did run a character counter and we are well under normal set size so it will be ok. Bruxton (talk) 19:51, 24 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Preps 3-5 have eight hooks instead of nine. The three misplaced hooks in prep 1 can be spread across those sets. I also notice that we are above the threshold for switching to two sets per day (10 preps/queues filled), so perhaps we can have a dog and a cat as lead April Fools' images.--Launchballer 20:22, 24 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
My warped mind wonders if we could run two different hooks that both use the same image. Because April. RoySmith (talk) 20:46, 24 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
If desired, we could alternate the dog and cat hooks through {{random item}}, as a sort of extra joke for anyone who happens to view the Main Page twice. It gets purged something like once per second, so it'd be truly random each time someone refreshed the page. Or we could do a time-based parser, even number of seconds or odd. (COI disclaimer one: I wrote the cat article.) (COI disclaimer two: That dog looks like a very good boy.) -- Tamzin[cetacean needed] (they|xe) 23:04, 24 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
If somebody could make that work, I think it would be awesome. RoySmith (talk) 23:11, 24 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@RoySmith:

Randomized
{{random item
|{{main page image/DYK|image=Green glowing cat.png|caption=An artist's impression of a ray cat}}<!--See [[Template:Main page image/DYK]] for other parameters-->
* ... that '''[[ray cat|color-changing cats]]''' ''(artist's impression pictured)'' could help us communicate with the future?
|{{main page image/DYK|image=Pep (inmate C-2559) mugshot.jpg|caption=Mugshot of Pep}}<!--See [[Template:Main page image/DYK]] for other parameters-->
* ... that '''[[Pep (dog)|Pep]]''' ''(pictured)'' was falsely accused of murdering a cat and sent to [[Eastern State Penitentiary]]?}}
Mugshot of Pep
Mugshot of Pep
Alternating every second
{{#ifexpr:{{#time:U}} mod 2
|{{main page image/DYK|image=Green glowing cat.png|caption=An artist's impression of a ray cat}}<!--See [[Template:Main page image/DYK]] for other parameters-->
* ... that '''[[ray cat|color-changing cats]]''' ''(artist's impression pictured)'' could help us communicate with the future?
|{{main page image/DYK|image=Pep (inmate C-2559) mugshot.jpg|caption=Mugshot of Pep}}<!--See [[Template:Main page image/DYK]] for other parameters-->
* ... that '''[[Pep (dog)|Pep]]''' ''(pictured)'' was falsely accused of murdering a cat and sent to [[Eastern State Penitentiary]]?}}
Mugshot of Pep
Mugshot of Pep

Just to be clear about how this would work, it wouldn't flicker on the Main Page or anything; the different versions would only show up on reload. The "every second" part shouldn't be an issue server-wise, since, like I said, the MP gets purged constantly regardless. -- Tamzin[cetacean needed] (they|xe) 00:11, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I'm always seeing the green cat in the example above, but I'm assuming there's just some cacheing that's getting in the way? RoySmith (talk) 02:31, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
On this page, if you're just refreshing, caching will probably keep it the same unless you purge (link); or it might change when someone comments somewhere. On the Main Page, the frequent purging by various actors takes care of that. -- Tamzin[cetacean needed] (they|xe) 03:58, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I'll add the randomized version, if no one minds. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 12:58, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Looks good to me, although the set isn't being transcluded properly at T:DYK/Q. Fixed. – Hilst [talk] 13:41, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@theleekycauldron: Not that it matters much, but will there be some way to make these count as only 12-/6-hour hooks (if on 24- or 12- respectively) at DYKSTATS? Since they'll average out to about that. -- Tamzin[cetacean needed] (they|xe) 16:00, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I'll note that this set should absolutely run for 24 hours, and I'll handle that when it comes up if need be. As for DYKSTATS... bleghh. I could code in some kind of override, but it'd probably be a bit hacky. theleekycauldron (talk • she/her) 18:00, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
IMHO, providing a fun experience for our readers trumps getting the statistics right. RoySmith (talk) 18:09, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

As theleekycauldron notes, we can run a single set for the day, and fit as many as we can (I think we've had as many as 11 hooks in a set, given that hooks for this day tend to be shorter), even if we're technically at two sets a day: we've had more sets or fewer sets for this day depending on what's been nominated and our frequency when the day comes around. It's also typical that not every hook nominated for April Fools runs on the day because not every one is prime AFD material. (In that case, they're put back on the Approved page and run later with one of the other approved hooks.) If the decision is taken to run two 12-hour sets, we could have the cat and dog hooks sharing the lead slot in both sets. BlueMoonset (talk) 22:09, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

how about we do a random item where either we have the dog in lead and the cat no. 2, or vice versa? theleekycauldron (talk • she/her) 22:43, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
That would be a better idea given that, unless the animals spread across two April Fools' sets, then they would only get half as long on the front page.--Launchballer 09:41, 29 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I've boldly implemented this. Feel free to revert.--Launchballer 19:06, 29 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
This implementation is breaking DYKUpdateBot User:Launchballer User:theleekycauldron. Shubinator (talk) 23:10, 31 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Reverted. Shubinator (talk) 23:18, 31 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Not an admin, so I can't help with things in queue, but that template was there before I started playing with it, all I did was adjust it so that both hooks appear at the same time (it didn't seem on that they only got "twelve" hours rather than 24).--Launchballer 23:31, 31 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Now that the set has been moved to the Main Page, can the randomizer be put back? -- Tamzin[cetacean needed] (they|xe) 00:07, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
If the randomizer is added now, DYKUpdateBot may crash on the next DYK update; it parses the outgoing set as part of archiving & tagging the outgoing image. Shubinator (talk) 00:29, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I've removed the randomizer. There should only be one picture hook per DYK rules, it risks breaking things as mentioned above, and it's unclear what this is adding.  — Amakuru (talk) 00:37, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
People liked both images, so this was the compromise that had consensus. Why not just leave the randomizer up and then take it down around 23:45? -- Tamzin[cetacean needed] (they|xe) 00:42, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
OK fine, I'm just waiting for protection to kick in on the second pic, then I'll reinstate.  — Amakuru (talk) 00:58, 1 April 2024 (UTC)  Done  — Amakuru (talk) 01:03, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
(edit conflict) Note that I've also increased the timer to keep this set around for the whole day, we can flip it back to two per day tomorrow. If some people like the dog pic we can swap it in half way through the day (remembering to protect it first).  — Amakuru (talk) 00:44, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

colin mackay

i'm sorry for putting a damper on the fun here, but i wanted to note that i have misgivings about the current colin mackay hook. i am not sure if it is a good idea to make light of a living person mourning the death of a predecessor whom he respected, and although i understand that the phrase "very sad" is in quotes because those were the words that mackay used, the quotation marks could easily be misinterpreted as scare quotes mocking his grief instead, especially considering the date the hook is scheduled to run. to be clear, i don't think the hook needs to be pulled, but i think it could use a good reformulation. below is one possibility.

alt2a: ... that Colin Mackay, the political editor at Scottish Television, had words of praise for Colin MacKay, a former political editor at Scottish Television?

dying (talk) 01:59, 30 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Nah, this is overthinking it. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 02:01, 30 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I do think that putting "very sad" in quotation marks reads oddly. As MOS:QUOTEPOV explains, Use of quotation marks around simple descriptive terms can imply something doubtful regarding the material being quoted. I might suggest the following:
Hydrangeans (she/her | talk | edits) 02:08, 30 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
ALT2B works, but it'd be better with a very Bremps... 05:15, 30 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I did wonder if it was worth ending with the second Colin, so something like: "... that Colin Mackay, the political editor at Scottish Television, was saddened by the death of the former political editor at Scottish Television Colin MacKay?"--Launchballer 06:40, 30 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
If we specify that one is the current and one is the former that would ruin the hookiness IMO. :( Bremps... 11:37, 30 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Fair cop, how about "... that Colin Mackay, the political editor at Scottish Television, was saddened by the death of the political editor at Scottish Television Colin MacKay?"--Launchballer 13:19, 31 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Time to go to two sets a day?

According to WP:DYKROTATE, If we are at one set per day and immediately after the midnight (UTC) update finishes there are more than 120 approved nominations while at least ten prep/queue sets are filled, we rotate to two sets per day. Immediately after midnight an hour or so ago, we had five full queues, five full preps, and 169 approved nominations (144 on the list plus 25 that aren't transcluding and thus aren't counted by DYKHousekeepingBot in making the list). Many thanks to PMC and Z1720 for loading up the queues, and AirshipJungleman29, Bruxton, and Rjjiii for filling preps (the remaining two preps only have two blank hooks each).

Please note that this will mean that the April Fools prep set currently building in Prep 1 will need to be dismantled, since the available preps and queues will only cover what's left of March, whether we switch over at noon today or at midnight tomorrow. (If Prep 7 is promoted to queue, then we could move those 1 April hooks to the newly empty prep as a temporary measure.) There are no other special occasion hooks in the current queues and preps aside from April Fools, so no other hooks will need to be moved for date reasons. BlueMoonset (talk) 01:27, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I know this is probably be a bit of a selfish request, but if this is to be done, would it be possible to hold Fūka Izumi until after returning to one set a day? I rarely have hooks up these days, and when it does happen they tend to coincide with two-sets-a-day periods and so my hooks tend to only run for 12 hours instead of the usual 24. I won't mind if the request isn't granted, I was just wondering. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 04:41, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I always think that we should accommodate the wishes and desires of those who contribute heaps to DYK, as long as it's a reasonable request. Your request is fair enough. Schwede66 05:19, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Prep 4 has a 4 April request.--Launchballer 07:27, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Launchballer, thanks for noting that. Once we've switched over to two per day, I'll pull the hook back to the special occasions section for repromotion later this week. BlueMoonset (talk) 22:20, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
We don't have five full sets. Someone has filled up Prep 1, the April Fool's set, with non-related hooks. In any case, we will need to rotate back to a 24-hour-set purely for April 1. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 10:48, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@AirshipJungleman29, was just going to post a message about the Fools' Day set. A number of the hooks in that prep area aren't in the planning space and the image isn't quite Fools-y (IMO, the ray cat is much better). Is this standard practice? Or will the hooks be switched out? Thanks! MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 12:42, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
No, Bruxton did it by accident MyCatIsAChonk. See the section above. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 12:45, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@AirshipJungleman29: When we engaged 12 hour sets prep 1 was no longer April 1 so I moved the items back. But I see they were moved back to prep one again. Bruxton (talk) 15:24, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Bruxton User:DYKUpdateBot/Time Between Updates's history shows that 12 hour sets were not actually put into practice. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 15:26, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@DYK admins: An oversight I think. The preps will be full as soon as another queue is promoted. We will have to rejigger the preps when it is engaged and we see where it lands. It would be a shame if we freeze all of these nominations for six days just to accommodate April one. Bruxton (talk) 15:32, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I think I am correct in saying that if 12-hour-sets are engaged, the April Fool's set will be prep 7, which can be promoted and cleared now. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 15:44, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Not sure, so we may have to rejigger on the fly. Bruxton (talk) 16:01, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Rejigging would probably be easier if you didn't promote hooks to that set Bruxton. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 18:07, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Note to AirshipJungleman29: at the time I posted this section, there were five full queues and five full preps just after a midnight promotion, which is the key; the preps were Prep 7 and Preps 2 through 5, so it did qualify. Prep 1 was not full and not counted, and it was clearly going to have to move anyway; I assumed that one of the filled preps would be moved up to Prep 1 when things were reorganized ... as will presumably still be the case. We now have six full queues and five full preps, again excluding Prep 1 (Preps 2 through 6 are full), so we should have ten full ones after the next promotion in a couple of hours. BlueMoonset (talk) 21:57, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I've switched to 12-hour sets. Could prep builders please start moving the 1 April hooks out of Prep 1? Schwede66 02:50, 26 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

 Done ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 02:58, 26 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Which admin are available?

@DYK admins: When the switch happens, we will need more admins to help with promoting preps to queues. Please indicate below if you will be available (or not available) to help during the next few weeks. Thanks, Z1720 (talk) 15:48, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Should be available except for a couple days around the eclipse. —Ganesha811 (talk) 15:50, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Probably, I should be able to muck in. Good to see that the project is actually consulting on who's available now, rather than just switching to two sets a day blindly!  — Amakuru (talk) 16:02, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
For the record, I will be busy the next few weeks. I'll try to promote but can't make any commitments. Z1720 (talk) 21:52, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I won't have time to do full sets in one sitting but I can chip in reviewing individual hooks, thus making it easier for other admins to do the remaining hooks in a set. Schwede66 02:50, 26 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I am still a bit burned out from the last round of 2/day updates (which coincided with a few days of bot outage) so I am not expecting to be of much help, if any. —Kusma (talk) 09:21, 26 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Special occasion, again

With the switch to 2/day, my special occasion hook is now mis-scheduled. It's Template:Did you know nominations/Singh v Canada in Prep 4 and I'd like it held for 4 April, which I suppose means pulling it out of prep and back into the special occasion holding area at Template talk:Did you know/Approved#4 April 2024. Thanks. – Reidgreg (talk) 14:25, 26 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Pulled. If someone could replace it while I'm out.--Launchballer 15:25, 26 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Weird glitch at Template talk:Did you know/Approved

I was trying to find my nomination Template:Did you know nominations/Josef Weiss approved section and had no luck at first. I now have just noticed that all the approved noms dating from March 16 after the Full Personality Expression nom have been strangely truncated. This needs to be fixed, particularly to make images visible for promoters as they decide which pictures to select. The truncated links hide the images, hooks, and conversations from view. 4meter4 (talk) 23:04, 26 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

That is due to the page exceeding WP:PEIS, which is why we're on two sets per day.--Launchballer 23:06, 26 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
~190 nominations on a single page will do that. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 23:21, 26 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
4meter4, there are a set of links near the top of wp:dykna that will allow you to view a subset of the approved nominations whenever the peis limit is exceeded. specifically, your nomination is currently viewable at the "Template talk:Did you know/Approved/week-2" page. dying (talk) 01:59, 30 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Main page DYK now and Wikipedia:Recent_additions/2024/March#27 March 2024 don't match?

Right now (since 00:00 UTC 27 March), the main page DYK is showing the group beginning ... that Jean Schwartz and William Jerome (pictured) wrote more than 1,000 popular songs together? and I have received a bot notification to that effect. So I'm happy! .

But I suspect that the editors who contributed to the list at Wikipedia:Recent_additions/2024/March#27 March 2024 (beginning ... that while named for alliums, the fossil Paleoallium (pictured) was not necessarily directly related to any allium species?) may not be?

Or have I micsonstrued? --𝕁𝕄𝔽 (talk) 00:46, 27 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

DYKs are archived by the time :) they're taken off the main page theleekycauldron (talk • she/her) 01:27, 27 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
For the record, you're not the only one who finds this confusing, especially considering the talk page banners. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 01:31, 27 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It is super confusing I think I've actually reported this as a bug in the bot at some point. I understand why we have to do it this way, but we might need to try to document this better. —Kusma (talk) 11:02, 27 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
JMF, if you are interested, more details on this issue can be found at wp:whyisrecentadditionsonedayoff. dying (talk) 01:59, 30 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Kusma For historical context, the current setup is a DYK community choice that predates DYKUpdateBot and its predecessors DYKadminBot & DYKBot. DYK started adding timestamps to the archives 15+ years ago in June 2008, before DYK updates were automated.
I agree the current setup is confusing, and would love to fix it. My understanding of what we're waiting on (full conversation at wp:whyisrecentadditionsonedayoff):
  1. Establishing consensus on the change, including its tradeoffs. (My sense is there is consensus that it's not ideal the archive links don't point to the "correct" set. I'm not sure we have consensus the proposed change is a net positive.)
  2. Specifically, the tradeoff around increasing difficulty of manual updates is an important one. Both of the last two manual updates made mistakes, which indicates the manual update process is already too confusing.
  3. Before floating a proposal to establish consensus, aligning on whether we would prefer to break continuity with the historical archives (not ideal) or recreate the historical archives (time consuming). If we don't want to break continuity, the historical archives should be recreated before we switch over behavior for the latest sets, and this will likely take weeks if not months.
Shubinator (talk) 12:48, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Queue 7

Petik and Sanos

(nom page: Template:Did you know nominations/Petik and Sanos)

Two things here. Firstly, I don't think the line "which was an illegal act in the Ottoman Muslim city" adheres to the rule that the hook fact must be clearly stated in the article and cited as such. I assume the line which is intended to cover this, is the one that reads "This large-scale restoration confirms the exclusive power of Petik and Sanos, since the expansion of Christian churches was prohibited by the Pact of Umar". This seems nowhere near as strong as saying that the expansion was "illegal", on the grounds that the city was "Ottoman Muslim". The Pact of Umar article suggests it's a rather vague thing whose origins are unknown, and the fact that the authorities sanctioned the expansion makes it seem like it probably wasn't illegal, at least not in a formal binding sense.

And secondly, it was raised at the nom page that the hook was confusing because it suggested that it was the Armenian church in general that was expanded, rather than a specific building. It seems like that issue has crept back in, because when I read the Armenian church in Aleppo I did not immediately infer that it was referring to a building. This is due to run on Friday, so unless a quick solution to the first issue is found, a postponement to a later date may be in order.

Pinging @Smpad, Alaexis, Mandarax, and AirshipJungleman29: who were involved with this hook.  — Amakuru (talk) 09:50, 27 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

"which was an illegal act in the Ottoman Muslim city" does not mean "it was illegal because Aleppo was Ottoman Muslim", as you Amakuru have interpreted above, but rather "it was illegal. Also, Aleppo was Ottoman Muslim."
I would suggest not relying on a badly-written Wikipedia article in your reasoning; the sources used here are clear that it was illegal, and would have been enforced as such, had the Armenians not managed to gain a personal exemption from the Sultan. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 10:11, 27 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@AirshipJungleman29: The hook fact needs to be clearly stated and cited in the article, per the DYK rules. Currently it is not, instead the hook is WP:SYNTHing several disparate points together. The article doesn't directly state that it was illegal, and anecdotally it seems an odd word to use for something that has received direct permission from the Sultan. But in any case, if the sources clearly state that it was illegal, then it shouldn't be difficult to have the article do so as well and we can probably move on from this. My interpretation doesn't really enter into that, although it does seem to me that by saying "which was an illegal act in the Ottoman Muslim city", you're directly or indirectly implying that the Ottoman Muslim status is related to the illegality, and the Pact of Umar is also one that relates to Muslim states.  — Amakuru (talk) 10:50, 27 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It appears I accidentally promoted the wrong hook, so sorry about that. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 13:22, 27 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Wait, are you looking at the amended version?
The source that describes these events says explicitly that "new construction of Christian space contravened Ottoman building regulations" (Semerjian). Alaexis¿question? 11:25, 27 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Alaexis: Ah, it looks like maybe the wrong version of the hook was promoted... I think the version of the hook you mention is a lot better in terms of integrity with the article... my only comment would be that the "Ottoman laws that banned new constructions and expansions of churches" still isn't quite stated in the text. For one thing it mentions expansion only, not construction, and secondly, it is not said in the article that it's an "Ottoman law", merely that the Pact of Umar prohibits it. I think if we can add a cited line to the article stating directly that this was an Ottoman law being broken, and (if we want to retain that bit) also mentioning that it included new construction, then this will be good to go. Cheers  — Amakuru (talk) 12:11, 27 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I've amended the article to clarify that the Ottoman building regulation was violated. I'm neutral regarding mentioning the new construction, feel free to remove that bit from the hook. Alaexis¿question? 12:41, 27 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Amakuru please lmk if something else is needed. I'm not the nominator but I really liked the article and would like to make sure it gets to the main page. Alaexis¿question? 22:00, 27 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Alaexis: thanks for the edits, and I think that's fine, I'm happy with it now. Cheers  — Amakuru (talk) 10:30, 28 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

White-winged tapaculo

(nom page: Template:Did you know nominations/White-winged tapaculo)

Minor point really, but this hook struck me as odd at first - if the name of the insect is "white-winged tapaculo" then I would expect the "named after" to refer to that. But obviously "white-winged tapaculo" name is not derived from the name of Krabbe, instead we find when we drill down into the article that it's the scientific name that is named after him. I don't know if any clarification is needed, perhaps the consensus will be that this is fine, but just noting that I was momentarily confused by this when reading the hook by itself. @AirshipJungleman29, Pbritti, and AryKun: who were involved with the hook.  — Amakuru (talk) 11:03, 27 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Maybe these would make it clear?
Of course, if consensus determines that the original hook is just fine then there's that. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 11:29, 27 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
" that the scientific name of the white-winged tapaculo comes from Niels Krabbe, who discovered seven other species in its genus?" The wording "comes from" might imply that Krabbe coined the name himself. It is more correct to say that "the scientific name of the white-winged tapaculo honors from Niels Krabbe, who discovered seven other species in its genus?" or that " that the scientific name of the white-winged tapaculo is derived from the name of Niels Krabbe, who discovered seven other species in its genus?" But your second suggestion is better than either of those.--User:Khajidha (talk) (contributions) 12:55, 27 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Khajidha and Narutolovehinata5: thanks for the responses. I've amended to use the second suggested alt. Thanks  — Amakuru (talk) 10:32, 28 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Older nominations needing DYK reviewers

The previous list of older nominations was archived a few hours ago, so I’ve created a new list of the first 37 nominations that need reviewing in the Older nominations section of the Nominations page, covering everything through March 18. We have a total of 315 nominations, of which 190 have been approved, a gap of 125 nominations that has decreased by 27 over the past 7 days. Thanks to everyone who reviews these and any other nominations.

More than one month old

Other nominations

Please remember to cross off entries, including the date, as you finish reviewing them (unless you're asking for further review), even if the review was not an approval. Please do not remove them entirely. Many thanks! BlueMoonset (talk) 19:07, 27 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Easter Prep 6

I noticed that we are not running any Easter hooks. March 31 is prep 6 which now leads with Hell Gate Bridge. I have an approved 3:16 game hook which may be Christianity related. Lightburst (talk) 19:14, 28 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

As it isn't Easter-related, there's no reason for it to be a special occasion hook on that date. Not every religious holiday needs to be celebrated at DYK. Three days before is not the time to go hunting for special occasion hooks for a particular date. BlueMoonset (talk) 22:52, 28 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for the message - does not have to be my hook. Since the holiday is still days away and there are 2.4 billion Christians in the world... maybe we can scare up one hook for the set? We spend quite a bit of effort for non-secular topics - but we made a great effort for Xmas. It is short time until Easter so I understand - admittedly I only just thoughtof Easter recently. Lightburst (talk) 23:17, 28 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I was asked on my talk, lengthy answer of frustration there. While I think I supplied a hook for each Easter so far since 2010, I still feel quite distant from DYK, so didn't this year. I looked over the nom page searching for something to approve, and the only one I found was Sodankylä Old Church. That seems to be close to an approval, and would make a better lead into an Easter set than something starting with "Hell", of all titles. If you like you can swap the Januschke hook (see above) into the Easter set, - it's not specifically Easter, but uplifting music, better suited to Easter than Good Friday (where it only landed because of the 2 sets per day). --Gerda Arendt (talk) 23:59, 28 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Alternatively, the above section ("Older nominations needing DYK reviewers") lists several Christian or Christian-related hooks that we could also use. This would not be celebrating any religious holiday, but simply pushing up older topical hooks to an Easter-themed set in acknowledgement of the holiday. Viriditas (talk) 00:21, 29 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I'm opposed to the idea. If they were about Easter, it would be one thing; this feels like deliberately pushing a religion on one of its holidays, which is something else. However, I'm one person, and one of the 70% of the world's population who isn't Christian, so perhaps I see things differently. As for the Januschke hook, I hardly feel that any hook about a "cheerfully amoral" Offenbach opera (per the article on Die Banditen) is appropriate for Easter! BlueMoonset (talk) 04:07, 29 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I suppose that’s one way of perceiving it, but it’s not how I view it. I don’t see "Easter" as purely Christian, but rather as a shared cultural event rooted in pluralism that has many different interpretations, ranging from scientific (Spring Equinox), to pagan (Ostara), and all other interpretations found around the world. The ideal DYK set would not be focused on Christianity but would rather celebrate and highlight our global heritage in relation to this holiday from many different traditions, secular and religious. Viriditas (talk) 04:36, 29 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Agree that Easter is a rather significant holiday. Like Gerda, I too think we risk looking a bit clueless by leading with hell on Easter Sunday. I also remember that last year several editors talked about a Ramadan set. It is Ramadan now, and it will end on April 9, 2024 with Eid al-Fitr. Maybe we can get a few hooks together for that date? Bruxton (talk) 14:01, 29 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Update: I moved the church to the prep 6 lead hook, and I moved Hell to Prep 4. Bruxton (talk) 14:41, 29 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

A 10th for April Fools'

I approved/ticked Template:Did you know nominations/Obsessed (Olivia Rodrigo song) for 1 April. It either needs to be moved to Prep 7 if it can run in that set (which already has 9 hooks, most of them short), or sent back for re-review as the hooks are inappropriate for any other day. Thanks. – Reidgreg (talk) 14:30, 29 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Instead of having 10 hooks, I would support moving Lianxing Temple, George E. Mylonas, or February 1983 North American blizzard to the quirky slot of another set as, to me, they are the weakest joke-y hooks in the set. Z1720 (talk) 14:34, 29 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Z1720: I will move George E. Mylonas to prep 3. If anyone objects we can move it back. Bruxton (talk) 14:47, 29 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I agree, Mylonas was by far the weakest of the set. I've promoted Obsession in its place.--Launchballer 15:07, 29 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks, all! BTW, I have another decent hook: ... that Ukrainian Sheriffs went to summer school after being shot?. I'd been expanding it for a contest and hadn't thought about the DYK until a few minutes ago. Needs review. It'll run on other days, though, I'm okay either way. – Reidgreg (talk) 19:24, 29 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Looks like the set came together. Good work to all concerned. Bruxton (talk) 02:31, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Process

I added Savika to Prep 4, but I’m pretty sure I did it wrong. Can someone step in and take a look? Zanahary (talk) 14:40, 29 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I've removed it as you can't promote your own hook. Another user will come along and do it properly for you.--Launchballer 14:47, 29 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I have checked the article and promoted it to prep. Bruxton (talk) 22:51, 29 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Ramadan Eid al-Fitr WP:DYKSO

I am hoping to get several hooks for a Ramadan set or partial set. The date of April 9, 2024 (Eid al-Fitr) marks the end of the holy month. Last year we discussed doing a set or partial set. We have eleven days to get any articles through our processes and promotion. We may have just enough time to spiff up an article or write new content. Bruxton (talk) 22:50, 29 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Bruxton: Any thoughts on articles you want to put into the set? Z1720 (talk) 22:59, 29 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
(edit conflict) There are some articles we can clean up in the template. {{Ramadan}}. Several are short enough to expand. Bruxton (talk) 23:02, 29 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I worked on expansion of Jumu'atul-Wida and I learned a few things. It will occur this year April 4-5. But I will likely nominate it and hope for April 9. Need to do a few QPQs to noiminate. Bruxton (talk) 01:43, 30 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I am not an expert in Islam, so if any of our editors can look the article over that would be helpful. I just 5x expanded it and nominated it for April 9. The actual last Friday of Ramadan is April 5 but I was not sure we could get this through our processes and checks in time. Bruxton (talk) 16:23, 30 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I have also expanded a second Ramadan related article about a television variety show. Fawazeer Ramadan. Bruxton (talk) 21:41, 30 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Marcelle (musical) prep 6 hook error

This is one of my nominations. I didn't see the alt hook which was proposed by someone else and approved. It isn't accurate. The mention of a male character must be in the hook or it doesn't make sense factually. A barmaid isn't a partial trouser role. A barmaid masquerading as a male soldier is a partial trouser role. As it it stands I would call the current hook in the prep factually inaccurate and confusing. It should be pulled and alt hook that I proposed approved rather than this bad hook. @Bruxton I notice you promoted this. Could you please swap out with a different hook? 4meter4 (talk) 03:32, 30 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

(edit conflict) It was a trim of your hook by Cielquiparle, but I will remove it as you request. Your hook had TMI and I agreed. Bruxton (talk) 03:37, 30 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Bruxton It was trimmed to the point of being confusing and factually inaccurate. The whole thing about the male soldier was cut which was essential to the factual accuracy of the"partial trouser role" fact. There's no such thing as a barmaid trouser role which is what the shortened hook was claiming. (that is a clearcut factual error) You can't trim out essential content when doing so transforms a hook from being accurate and precise into essentially nonsense with no intelligible meaning. In the trimmed version it was no longer clear that the character was switching gender roles, which was the whole point of the hook and what made it hooky.4meter4 (talk) 03:59, 30 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you for the explanation; Cielquiparle and myself were mistaken. Hopefully it gets sorted by the next promotor. Bruxton (talk) 14:01, 30 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for resolving by proposing ALT hooks, @AirshipJungleman29, and hold your line next time @Bruxton. There is always a subjective element to DYK and I think your each having promoted ~1k of them counts for something. Appreciate you both. Cielquiparle (talk) 18:08, 30 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Blacking out the page locally on eclipse day

A few days ago on this page (I can't find it now), I suggested the DYK part of the main page be blacked out in North America for the solar eclipse on the 8th of April. I got a few positive responses. Are there any admins here on board with my plan? Bremps... 11:47, 30 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I'm opposed to having a localised Main Page. Also, isn't an eclipse more for ITN? —Kusma (talk) 16:37, 30 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yeah, it's not as if Solar eclipse of April 8, 2024 is even anywhere near to Main Page quality, let alone new/expanded 5x. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 16:42, 30 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose as this isn't a worldwide event, doesn't actually showcase DYK or benefit readers, and the article for this event isn't even DYK eligible. Also, pretty sure that different main pages for people based on location isn't even possible (or if it is, it's a lot of work and way outside the remit of DYK). Joseph2302 (talk) 00:07, 31 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
At first glance I thought it may be interesting to black it out for the exact moment of greatest eclipse (UTC) 18:18:29. The article is not in ship shape as AirshipJungleman29 has said, so this may not work well. Lightburst (talk) 01:06, 31 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I think this is a cute idea; however I'm against it on technical grounds as it would affect readability and could inconvenience readers (I'm already not a fan of how many of our current dark mode appearances look). In addition, the other editors have a point in that this isn't a global event. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 01:17, 31 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Unprotected image

@DYK admins: DYKUpdateBot couldn't update the template due to File:The old church of Sodankylä.jpg not being protected. Can someone fix this? – Hilst [talk] 12:17, 31 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

OK, on it.  — Amakuru (talk) 12:29, 31 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@DYK admins: @Hilst: actually, I can't be "on it" unfortunatley as it seems Krinklebot is down. We'll need a COmmons admin to protect the image. Does anybody know of one? I've uploaded the set with no image for the time being. About to have lunch so will do the credits later if nobody else does. Cheers  — Amakuru (talk) 12:43, 31 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@DYK admins: red alert, the April Fools' set is on the main page for some reason! ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 13:12, 31 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Fixed by Amakuru! In other news, the church image can now be used safely. – Hilst [talk] 13:26, 31 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
(edit conflict) I've rolled that back, so the intended set is there again. It looks like Krinklebot kicked back into life again, and that prompted DYK bot to do an update. I'm not sure if I was supposed to do something to tell it not to act? I haven't done a manual promotion for a while... Anyway, since the pic is now protected I've added that in too. We'll need to wind back the queues again too before the next update, I'll do that shortly.  — Amakuru (talk) 13:28, 31 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
For future reference:
  • If performing a manual update, please follow the steps described in the "Manually posting the new update" section of the DYK queues. Not doing so can result in collisions between humans and bot, or between humans and other humans.
  • As described by DYKUpdateBot, please follow these instructions if KrinkleBot is down - there's no requirement for a Commons admin to be around.
  • The "random item" template in Queue 7 is crashing DYKUpdateBot. I'll start it back up, so the bot will update T:DYK, but will again crash before distributing credits for this set. Communicating special sets ahead of time can help us avoid these situations in the future.
Shubinator (talk) 23:08, 31 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I've reverted the "random item" template in Queue 7, so DYKUpdateBot should stay alive. Shubinator (talk) 23:20, 31 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Shubinator, any idea why the bot hasn't updated the main page with the new DYK set? Q1 was supposed to go live 20 minutes ago. Schwede66 00:21, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I see that there's a discussion below. Schwede66 03:33, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Queue 3

Biodiversity Impact Credit

@Pinkchiken, Silver seren, and AirshipJungleman29:

There are several uncited passages that will need citations. I have indicated these in the article with citation needed tags. Z1720 (talk) 14:52, 31 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I've added a few more tags in the lead for uncited facts mentioned there that don't seem to be in the body. This was a fairly glaring error IMHO, and no doubt just a rare oversight... but as a reminder it's the job of everyone: reviewers, prep builders and promoting admins alike, to ensure the hooks and articles meet the quality criteria. This triple check should ultimately provide some redundancy in ensuring the hooks are as good as we can get them, but ideally issues are spotted before they're in the queue and subject to the final check. Cheers  — Amakuru (talk) 15:09, 31 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Time to pull this hook? The hook's still on Queue and the tags remain unresolved. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 22:33, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Pulled. Schwede66 23:35, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Queue 4

A-Channel

@Sammi Brie, RickyCourtney, and Hilst:

I added a cn tag to a sentence that should be resolved before it goes on the Main Page. Z1720 (talk) 02:34, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

A bit off-topic but I was a bit disappointed this wasn't a GA about the anime A Channel. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 23:47, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Forgot to ping @Z1720 but I decided to fold the intro sentence (it's a summary of the next two paragraphs) in for now. I disagree it needs a citation; it's basically a one-sentence lead for the next two paragraphs. Sammi Brie (she/her • t • c) 06:10, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
My concern has been resolved. Z1720 (talk) 17:39, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Randy Travis

@TenPoundHammer, Lightburst, 4meter4, and Bruxton:

I added two cn tags that will need to be resolved before this appears on the Main Page. Z1720 (talk) 02:49, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I removed the first sentence that needed a citation. The second one, under "Awards", I feel does not need a citation as it is a summary of content both found elsewhere in the article and on the subpage mentioned above. Ten Pound Hammer • (What did I screw up now?) 17:08, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you @TenPoundHammer: Bruxton (talk) 17:57, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Aleksandra Waliszewska (Prep 6)

Untitled (2012–2013) by Aleksandra Waliszewska
Untitled (2012–2013) by Aleksandra Waliszewska

@Apocheir, Lajmmoore, and Hilst: Looking at the nomination page, this hook's "media marker" seems to have been added rather awkwardly, as it explicitly self-references the accompanying image rather than subtly through an italic "(pictured)". I don't think that this is particularly helpful here, so I suggest that a more usual phrasing would be something like the following:

— RAVENPVFF · talk · 15:54, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Since it's no longer in the running for April Fools, I'm going to change it back to the original ALT2. Apocheir (talk) 19:05, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Ok, no problem. – Hilst [talk] 00:40, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you @Apocheir that's great Lajmmoore (talk) 22:56, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Prep 2

Krisztofer Mészáros

... that in 2021 Krisztofer Mészáros became the first Hungarian male gymnast in 22 years to qualify for a world championship all-around final?

If I look at Gymnastics World Championships, there are multiple types of gymnastics world championships. Is the hook suppose to imply he was the first of any (generic) world championship, or specifically the World Artistic Gymnastics Championships (which is what the hook links to)? If the latter, showing only "world championship" without any other qualification seems incorrect. Notifying DYK participants Riley1012 and OlifanofmrTennant—Bagumba (talk) 15:57, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The second one. Questions? four Olifanofmrtennant (she/her) 16:04, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
OK. I've updated the hook to unpipe and just display "World Artistic Gymnastics Championships".—Bagumba (talk) 16:15, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Special occasion again

It looks like we moved back to 24-hour sets which has knocked Template:Did you know nominations/Singh v Canada out of its special occasion of 4 April again. Would appreciate if someone could move it from Prep 6 to Queue 3. Thanks. – Reidgreg (talk) 16:35, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Reidgreg I believe we should be moving back to 12-hour sets on 2 April, so Prep 6 should still hit main page on 4 April. It is good that you are watching out for last minute changes. TSventon (talk) 16:43, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Okay, thanks! – Reidgreg (talk) 17:40, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Not only that, but Prep 6 (now promoted to Queue 6) is actually best for a Canada-based April 4 hook, since it will run during the day there. BlueMoonset (talk) 19:43, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Queue 2: Thambi Naidoo

(nom page: Template:Did you know nominations/Thambi Naidoo)

A couple of points here - firstly, I think "register" is a bit confusing here, and should probably be expanded to "register as an Asian" or similar. Secondly, the "sent outside of" part is also a bit confusing. The wording is unusual, and there seems to be a small discrepancy between the article text

  • "Later that year, he boycotted the mandatory registration and was forced outside of Transvaal, and was arrested in January of 1908 along with Gandhi"

and the source text

  • "On December 28 that year, he was charged for refusing to register and sent out of Transvaal> When he refused to obey the orders, he, along with Gandhiji, was arrested on January 10, 1908 and sent to jail"

The latter suggests that he wasn't actually "sent out" but instead refused, and he was subsequently arrested for that refusal. Whether he actually left Transvaal isn't stated, but he was back there again by 1913 anyway. Maybe it's all fine, but just Thought I'd raise this. Pinging @Ktin, Grnrchst, and Hilst:  — Amakuru (talk) 17:27, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Agree with expanding the registering part, no comment on "sent out", though we could just omit it if needed. – Hilst [talk] 00:43, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Agree with the above. Ktin (talk) 02:00, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Queue 2: Aisling (book series)

  • ... that the novel series Aisling is based on a character archetype elaborated upon by users of a Facebook group?

(nom page: Template:Did you know nominations/Aisling (book series))

Not sure if it's just me, but I found this hook a bit misleading. It gives the impression that the Facebook group actually had a hand in developing the story or the character in some way... However, the article has a weaker version of this, with no sense of the group having "elaborating" the character, but merely discussed. The sole secondary source for this is [2], which credits the group as having given the authors the inspiration to go ahead and public, but doesn't say that the published character was actually "based on" anything that had been discussed within the group.

Pinging @AirshipJungleman29, Bogger, Lajmmoore, Narutolovehinata5, and Launchballer:. Cheers  — Amakuru (talk) 17:36, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Would ALT3a solve the issue? I was actually surprised ALT3 was the version that was promoted as I preferred ALT3a, but the hook got promoted before I could give my opinion. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 21:48, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I'm happy with ALT3a too Lajmmoore (talk) 22:53, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
ALT3a for me too. [The point being that the "character" was recognisable, the people bought into it, added to the lore, in a sort of fan-fiction way, but the rights to this particular Aisling and her story belong to the authors.] -Bogger (talk) 07:33, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Queue 5: Peter Patton

  • ... that Peter Patton was given the nickname General Patton by the father of his college coach?

Nom page: Template:Did you know nominations/Peter Patton (basketball)

Minor point probably, but the article says "He attended a camp by Ray Meyer in Wisconsin as a 6th grader, earning the nickname General Patton"... i.e. doesn't directly say that it was Meyer himself who gave him that nickname, it could have been a fellow campmate for example. I can't access the source, so not sure what that says... assuming it was Meyer who gave him the name, we probably want to clarify in the article. Pinging @4meter4, TonyTheTiger, Premeditated Chaos, and Bruxton:  — Amakuru (talk) 18:25, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I'll leave it to Tony to clarify as I can't access the source either.4meter4 (talk) 18:35, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Queue 6

Hesperocyparis guadalupensis

@MtBotany, Kevmin, and Bruxton:

I have added a citation needed tag to a sentence in the "Conservation and restoration" section that will need to be resolved before this goes on the Main Page. Z1720 (talk) 19:44, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

This was a promotion that I depromoted in order to move and then promoted with pshaw. I have erased the uncited sentence. Bruxton (talk) 19:51, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for fixing that problem. I remember seeing that sentence when I started editing the page and thought, "I need to find a source for this or delete it," and then forgot about it. 🌿MtBotany (talk) 21:43, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

DYKUpdateBot turned off to avoid undefined adminbot behavior

Summarizing the conversation above, DYKUpdateBot does not support the randomizer added in the April Fools set. I've turned off the bot to avoid an adminbot running with undefined behavior. Shubinator (talk) 00:00, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Shubinator the idea was to leave the randomizer up and then take it down around 23:45 on 1 April. Is it possible to remove the randomizer and then turn DYKUpdateBot on again after a short interval? TSventon (talk) 00:16, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Shubinator: I've removed the randomizer. —Bagumba (talk) 01:13, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Schwede66 this is why the MP hasn't changed yet. TSventon (talk) 00:21, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@DYK admins: Would a manual update mess with the bot? If not, then I think it should be done, pretty please with a bronze star on top – Q1 is nearly an hour overdue to be switched in :/ Dylan620 (he/him • talk • edits) 00:51, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
We also need an admin to revert us to two sets a day now that April Fools' is over. Pinging Amakuru, who set things to one set a day yesterday at about this time, though any admin is welcome to do so. Thanks! BlueMoonset (talk) 01:32, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Z1720: can you help? Bruxton (talk) 01:55, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I've done the manual update steps 1 to 7. That should be the urgent stuff. Could someone else please deal with steps 8 to 11? I have some real work to get done...
Given that we were nearly 4 hours late with the update, I haven't reset the update cycle to 12-hour sets yet. Maybe we'll let this set run for 20 hours and reset the clock then? Schwede66 03:58, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I suggest 16 hours each, but be careful of that 4 April date request.--Launchballer 08:39, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I don't even know where this gets changed at, but I will say that the best bet is likely to require the fewest number of manual changes to get this all back to automated (KISS). Let it run to 00:00 GMT then switch back to 12 hr. As this has shown, getting a bunch of WP:VOLUNTEERs to manually coordinate this to a precise timing (e.g. 16 hr, then change again to 12 hr) is no small task. Thanks to all who make this work.—Bagumba (talk) 09:01, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Bruxton: Sorry that I did not respond to this, as I was about to log off when I got the ping. Z1720 (talk) 15:11, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
No worries, I was concerned because there are so many hooks waiting. Looks like it got sorted. Bruxton (talk) 16:29, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I have cleared queue 2. I think Schwede66 has reverted the bot, and I think the Main Page has been updated. Z1720 (talk) 00:45, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yeah, I'm part of the way of giving credits. Have also reverted to 12-hour sets. Schwede66 00:47, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Both queue 1 and 2 haven't been cleared properly, you should replace all text with {{User:DYKUpdateBot/REMOVE THIS LINE}}. – Hilst [talk] 00:49, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Z1720 see above. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 00:57, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
or Schwede66 ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 01:15, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I'm done with the manual update. Schwede66 01:20, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Wonderful. Hopefully Shubinator can restart the bot now. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 01:25, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
DYKUpdateBot is back up and running! Thanks everyone who chipped in, especially AirshipJungleman29 for getting this across the finish line and Hilst for flagging tooling inconsistencies after the manual updates. Shubinator (talk) 06:20, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
That sounds fine, but if I'm not missing something, o credits were given to talk pages and user talk pages for the last archived set. - I received one for the set now on the Main page, that looks promising. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 13:36, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
 Done. – Hilst [talk] 20:29, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Template:Did you know nominations/Killing of David Ben Avraham

Considering current events and the topic of the subject, I'm requesting comments on whether or not featuring this article on Did you know with any hook would be appropriate. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 02:10, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I find my sense of it is similar to that of starship.paint as expressed in the nomination: being neutral and avoiding sensationalism doesn't mean "don't make anyone look bad". I think it's a worse look if we as a project get such cold feet that we refrain to recognize valid content. It may generate an impression we don't want to spread the notion that harm to a civilian took place in a nation state plausibly charged with violations of international conventions about harming civilians. Hydrangeans (she/her | talk | edits) 04:45, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
To add on, NPOV means we reflect reliable sources neutrally. If reliable sources’ majority view is that “X is bad” or “X is false” then we should reflect that. Given that the reporting is by mainstream Israeli newspapers that are already less likely to be pro-Palestinian, I do not see why we cannot have a hook on this subject. starship.paint (RUN) 05:03, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
For what it's worth, had it been the other way around (i.e. a Palestinian killing an Israeli), I would have had similar concerns. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 05:29, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I find it hard to not read the initial hook as deliberately inflammatory. ATL1 is better, but still not great. CMD (talk) 06:21, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Are those hooks interesting for anyone?

See Template:Did you know nominations/Swift Orange Line. I hate to fail this but I find the hooks very boring, which goes against DYK concept. But maybe someone will be more positive, I don't mind if it is passed, but I cannot do it myself, since, as I said, I find all proposed hooks very boring. Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 03:46, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The landfill hook is the most interesting of the options, IMO. I would be fine with running that hook. The rest are pretty boring and typical of a rail line. Z1720 (talk) 13:23, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Is boring and typical for rail a good or bad sign given the article is about a bus line? A new ALT5 passed by Piotrus works well for me too. CMD (talk) 01:12, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I agree that ALT3–5 are sufficiently interesting, and ALT5 highlights an edge that makes the detail pop. Hydrangeans (she/her | talk | edits) 04:46, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Template:Did you know nominations/ Jordan Murphy (basketball)

The bot/tool for DYK creation gave me an error and I have tried to create it manually. I ended up with a Template:Did you know nominations/Jordan Murphy (basketball)2 and writing over Template:Did you know nominations/ Jordan Murphy (basketball) (in the presence of Template:Did you know nominations/Jordan Murphy (basketball))?--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 10:53, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Fixed. You don't need both, so I've redirected the older of the two.--Launchballer 11:09, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
What is the standard syntax for the repeater DYK (a space in front or a numeral after)?-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 11:52, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I believe that the syntax for a repeat nomination is a space and numeral after, e.g. Template:Did you know nominations/Stowe Gardens 2. TSventon (talk) 11:58, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
With the redirect already pointing to the current location, what should we do to name it correctly?-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 12:14, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I would argue it should really be "Jordan Murphy (basketball) (2nd nomination)", absolutely not worth moving now.--Launchballer 12:23, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • I am sure that there have been several repeaters go through the system. I can see several possible conventions. (#, _#, /#, /DYK#,_(#th nomination)—underscore being a space). Before we have a whole bunch of each, can we come to a formal agreement? Then can we update the bot/tool to automatically name following an agreed convention?-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 17:56, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Are we making sets too long?

I've been watching how the new 9-hook sets are working. As I remember, the original concept was we could use 9 hooks as long as they're all pretty short. Today they're all tending to the long side. On my desktop, it looks fine, but on my phone, the DYK section blows way past the bottom of OTD. On the other hand, part of the problem seems to be that TFA is also running long, so it pushed DYK down. RoySmith (talk) 15:51, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

No, this also happened with 8-hook sets, because for some reason the font size of ITN/OTD on mobile is lower than TFA/DYK. No clue why. This obviously doesn't affect the mobile view, which is how 99% readers will be using the site. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 15:59, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I often measure total characters of each set. I have not been measuring every set, but I think they vary between 870-1200 for a set including the ... ellipsis. I think the sweet spot is 1000-1100 characters. Each hook can be 200 characters but that is usually rare. And obviously If there were 9 200 character hooks it would not work. I did change one prep 3 yesterday to eight hooks for balance it has 8 hooks and is 1138 characters. The set right now is 1051 characters and has nine hooks. The next set queue 2 is 1075. Queue 3 is 1115 Characters. The one after that is queue 4 - 1100. Maybe queue 5 could use an extra hook because it is 928 characters with nine hooks. Bruxton (talk) 16:17, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I just promoted one very short quirky hook to the end of prep 3, it's now 1192. I think it can take it.--Launchballer 16:37, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I am the one that proposed adding a hook to the DYK set to make it 9-a-set. I checked on two different computers and on them right now the OTD is slightly shorter by two lines, which would make me consider adding a short hook if I had more time. I cannot check the length on my phone because it keeps sending me to the app, which formats the Main Page differently. Z1720 (talk) 16:46, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
When did you propose this? I mentioned trying to make the sets longer (9 or 10) and always having 24 hour sets a few months ago.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 18:03, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I wouldn't optimize for desktop view on phone. I use it, but I assume its limited to a niche group of editors, and not general readers. —Bagumba (talk) 04:51, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Really? I've always assumed that it's far from niche as possible. I've been viewing and editing on mobile since the 2000s. I suspect the vast majority of younger people do so on phones or tablets. When I write articles, I always try for a happy balance on desktop and mobile. Viriditas (talk) 08:38, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I meant the niche is that its a group of editors, not the general reader. —Bagumba (talk) 09:13, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Got it. Thanks. Viriditas (talk) 09:17, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Multiple article hooks/nominations

Do we have a place that addresses the process for multi-article nominations? I know it is sort of self explanatory in the template, but I recently came across an editor who nominated each article individually but was wanting to bundle them in a single hook. (see Template:Did you know nominations/Mirna El Helbawi) It would have been helpful to have had a written guideline on process to point them to. Does one exist somewhere? I'm not seeing any mention of it on the DYK pages.4meter4 (talk) 02:46, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Hi, so I was the nominator, I'm totally happy for them to go separately. I agree guideline on this would be helpful, I nominated both because I couldn't find a guideline. John Cummings (talk) 19:18, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@John Cummings I thought that was probably the issue. We need to have some sort of guideline visible at WP:DYKRULES that addresses this. Pinging some DYK regulars to comment: @ TonyTheTiger, Launchballer, Viriditas, Shubinator, Schwede66, AirshipJungleman29, BlueMoonset please comment. Thanks.4meter4 (talk) 19:36, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Requesting second reviewer for Template:Did you know nominations/Mohammad Saifullah Ozaki

Hi all

I'm just starting reviewing for DYK, I've just finished my first one, could someone please check everything is correct before I notify? Its a nomination due to it being approved as a GA so I feel pretty confident its good. Also I reviewed Template:Did you know nominations/Kentucky Educational Television, if someone could check that one too, that would be great.

Thanks, John Cummings (talk) 19:20, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Are there any special rules around DYK for current/recent events?

Hi all

I'm thinking about nominating an article for DYK which was a recent event, can anyone tell me if there are any special reuqirements around this? I don't see anything in the guideance but maybe I'm missing something. Thanks, John Cummings (talk) 19:22, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The article needs to meet WP:DYKNEW; in particular, if the article has appeared as a bold link at WP:ITN in the last year, it is not eligible. —Kusma (talk) 19:41, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Ok, thanks very much. I guess I'd like to avoid a situation where I nominate an article for DYK and someone else nominates it for ITN and then they both get disqualified. John Cummings (talk) 21:22, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
John Cummings, do you want to reveal your secret of which article you are considering for nomination? It's easier for somebody to have a quick look and give you a definite answer, rather than reciting the somewhat intricate eligibility rules that are documented at WP:DYKCRIT. Schwede66 21:58, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

QPQ instructions on Wikipedia:Did you know/Reviewer instructions are not very clear

Hi all

I've started doing DYK reviews, partially to fullfil QPQ, but also because its interesting. I'm pretty confident I understand all the other instructions, but I'm finding it difficult with the QPQ requirement. The requirement is extremely clear but there don't appear to be any instructions on how to check if the requirement has been met. Is there an automated way ro process to check this? If so please can it be added to the instructions for new people?

Thanks

John Cummings (talk) 20:28, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

John Cummings, QPQs don't just have to exist but also need to be provided on a nomination. If a QPQ is not in some way provided in the nomination, usually as a bullet point like this:then the QPQ requirement has not been met.
Hope this helps! — ezlev (user/tlk/ctrbs) 23:01, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
John Cummings, a QPQ needs to be a full review of one other nomination. I click on the QPQ link and check the nominator has done a full review, using either a checklist or a sentence like the example at the bottom of Wikipedia:Did you know/Reviewer instructions. If the review was failed without a full review, that does not count. If they passed the nomination with no comments, I would ask them to add a sentence to summarise the checks they had done. If there are outstanding questions, I accept the QPQ but watchlist the review to see that the reviewer finishes it. Other reviewers may do things slightly differently. TSventon (talk) 00:07, 4 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

No update?

DYKUpdateBot hasn't moved Queue 4 yet. It also hasn't reported any errors for some reason. – Hilst [talk] 00:14, 4 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The bot hit a 503 Server Error and crashed; I've started it up again and it's chugging through the update now! Shubinator (talk) 00:36, 4 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
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