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Executive Actions are actually a thing

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Can we rename this "Executive Orders and Memorandums" and not "Executive Actions"? Executive Actions actually exists; they are the non-binding resolutions of the Executive branch. Obama had a single Executive Action on gun control, a list of things he cared so deeply about he made a list and that was it, not a bit of actual power was behind it though, cause "Action"; of course Actions have no actual anything behind them. They are at most a way for a President to receive some public feedback on some ideas they're having, without changing a single thing with the government. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.107.138.23 (talk) 02:48, 19 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]


Presidential Memoranda vs. Executive Orders

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According to the White House, there has only been one executive order issued. The remainder of the listed items here are actually Presidential Memoranda. This may be a highly technical difference in many ways. But since executive orders are numbered and memoranda are not, this is a problem for this page, which is only supposed to list the executive orders. In particular, Donald Trump has only issued one executive order, 13765. But there are now five others (all memoranda) listed with their own numbers, even though they don't actually have them. So if Trump issues another executive order, its number will conflict with that of the presidential memorandum listed.

If we're tracking presidential memoranda, we should do so on a different page or at least in a separate table. As is, we are misleading readers as to what is and is not an executive order. Federal executive orders have a specific meaning and tracking requirements. Most of the current entries do not fit the definition nor are subject to the tracking requirement. To be BOLD, I'm going to move the memoranda into a separate table on this page. That will be cluttered but less confusing when there is a second executive order. Mdfst13 (talk) 22:06, 24 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Here it says there are 10 executive orders - http://www.pbs.org/newshour/rundown/10-executive-actions-trump-signed-far/ - Jesse Schulman (talk) 02:22, 25 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Jesse Schulman, that link says executive actions not executive orders. Both presidential memoranda and executive orders (also presidential proclamations) are presidential actions, as can be seen in the Briefing Room links in my first post. But only executive orders are, well, executive orders. I'd be fine with combining the two if and only if we also did that for Barack Obama. However, Obama's 270+ executive orders only include actual executive orders, so someone would have to go back and find out what presidential memoranda he issued and add all of them. Also, that would leave us inconsistent with sources saying that Obama had 270+ executive orders. If we expanded to all executive actions, Obama's number would be bigger (Phil found about 650, so around 920 total). Mdfst13 (talk) 13:16, 26 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Very interesting point Mdfst13 - I don't know the difference but I'll take your word for it! I see the advantage of separating out the 'memoranda' from the 'orders' into separate tables, but perhaps there is a greater usefulness to our readers to keep them all grouped chronologically rather than divided by legal format (since to the public the difference is so slight). Is there a way to integrate them all on the same table, but add a sortable column to differentiate 'order' from 'memorandum' (and perhaps to rename the whole article itself to 'list of executive orders and memoranda signed by President Trump' or something like that)? Wittylama 10:14, 25 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]
If Presidential Memoranda are going to be listed here, they should also be listed for all other presidents preceding as far as the information is available, otherwise it is inconsistent, and perhaps biased.208.69.13.186 (talk) 14:22, 25 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Indeed perhaps they should! But it would be a false argument to say that the should not be included here simply because we've not [yet?] done it for the other preceding articles. Wittylama 14:35, 25 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]
It would be great to have it for as many as possible, starting with this one and working forwards/backwards, actually. But if it remains inconsistent for too long it could be viewed as partisan, given the current arguments over which presidents use executive orders more than others and what that supposedly means (or doesn't mean). Including it for one party and not another would tend to give the impression of an inflated number for the one it is included in. Granted, though, it is much easier to keep track of it from now going forward than it is to find a complete list for past presidents, since Presidential Memoranda are not tracked in the same way as Executive Orders.208.69.13.186 (talk) 16:50, 25 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Here's a good explanation of the difference - http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/onpolitics/2017/01/24/executive-order-vs-presidential-memorandum-whats-difference/96979014/ - Jesse Schulman (talk) 17:39, 25 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

The Federal Register does apparently record memoranda although I haven't yet found an index page, here is an example of the one regarding withdrawal from the TPP. https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2017/01/25/2017-01845/withdrawal-of-the-united-states-from-the-trans--pacific-partnership-negotiations-and-agreement I would think these would be preferred references to include if Memoranda are being listed. This link might be useful in finding additional ones both going forward and back if someone wants to work on it. Phil (talk) 22:26, 25 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Regarding listing them going back for other Presidents as well, Obama's can be found here https://obamawhitehouse.archives.gov/briefing-room/presidential-actions and from the listing of 10/page it looks like he had ~650 during his administration. I'd say based on that and Trump's usage of them so far, if someone were going to seriously index those as is being done with executive orders on these pages, they would warrant their own page. Phil (talk) 22:32, 25 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Memoranda can be found here for Trump, several seem missing on this page and some on this page don't exist on the WH page - https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/presidential-actions/presidential-memoranda - Jesse Schulman (talk) 23:17, 25 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]
I found the actual numbers for each through that link. 275 executive orders, 644 presidential memoranda, and 1186 presidential proclamations. The way that I calculated this was to click on the Next link, which shows that the second page has a page=1 get variable. Then I would change the page to 27, 64, or 118 respectively and count the number on that page. That would give 27*10 + 5, 64 * 10 + 4, and 118 * 10 + 6 of each. Also, it is my understanding that only some of the presidential memoranda are included in the Federal Register, while all the executive orders are. This was covered in the USA Today story that I linked in the original post. Mdfst13 (talk) 13:47, 26 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]
I've started with List of executive actions by George W. Bush adding those other actions along with references. - Kiraroshi1976 (talk) 19:36, 25 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

White House Briefing Room

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This is being updated. Oceanflynn (talk) 05:53, 28 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Can we rename this something that more people can understand?

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Maybe List of United States federal executive orders signed by President Trump? Executive number 13765 is completely meaningless to 99% of Americans. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Sandiego91 (talk • contribs) 13:34, 28 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Makes sense to me. It's obviously the reason why the list is divided in the way it is. "List of Donald Trump executive orders and memoranda?"--NapoliRoma (talk) 21:45, 28 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]
That would then be inconsistent with all the other pages. Also, it would encourage people to come straight to this page rather than starting on the main list, which is where "list of executive order by Trump" currently links from Google. This page is not intended to stand alone. It's the links to it that should be given descriptive names. Mdfst13 (talk) 23:04, 29 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]
I agree that having the titles refer to presidencies makes more sense than titles with arbitrary numbers. It's odd that orders are organized by administration but the titles refer to the numeric ranges that result from this system rather than directly to the respective presidency. Other "List of United States federal executive orders..." should also be changed to follow the same convention. Mdfst13, why would we want to direct people to the overall list if they're looking for a specific president's orders? We should help people access information directly whenever possible rather than deliberately forcing them to go through a higher level article.--Bkwillwm (talk) 03:30, 30 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]
"That would then be inconsistent with all the other pages." Well, yes--the other pages should be similarly changed. I'm not sure what the concern would be about people coming straight to this page, if that's where the appropriate content that they're looking for is.--NapoliRoma (talk) 06:22, 30 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]
As those lists of orders are already grouped by administration, It makes total sense to change their titles to include the name of the President signing them. in addition, because the lists contain both Executive Orders and Presidential Memoranda, and to avoid a two-line-long title, I would suggest List of executive actions by Donald Trump and the same pattern for every prior President. Opinions before I boldly go ahead? — JFG talk 07:54, 30 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Support for all of the above reasons. RadiculousJ (talk) 19:22, 30 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Support. I would suggest that the parent article, when linking to these lists, can note parenthetically "(executive orders 13765 and above)" (using the appropriate range for each one, of course) after each link.--NapoliRoma (talk) 00:55, 31 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Note: These articles also should be renamed similarly. Tom Ruen (talk) 22:40, 30 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I would also support these renamings, but don't think this one page is the proper place to decide on the names for a group of articles, more than just this one. LadyofShalott 02:01, 31 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]
 Done I've renamed the Trump list; will get to the others soon unless there's backlash. — JFG talk 15:09, 1 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Oh, RadiculousJ beat me to it, thanks! — JFG talk 15:13, 1 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]
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Is it appropriate to link article text to Wikisource URLs? Or, is it worth noting that when users click on these links they will be taken outside Wikipedia? Not sure what is common practice re: use of Wikisource links. ---Another Believer (Talk) 19:41, 31 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

The majority of the links to specific orders in year 2018 and later do not have an actual Wikisource page, so display an error page. I see 4 options, I defer to Wikipedia norms as to what we should do: 1. Flag the link appropriately, showing red or similar? The Wikisource summary does so at https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Author:Donald_John_Trump/Executive_orders 2. The link could instead go to the Federal Register, for example https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2021/01/04/2020-29235/expanding-educational-opportunity-through-school-choice 3. Remove links for those orders that do not have Wikisource pages. 4. Do nothing, readers will get errors until the Wikisource pages are created. 73.209.182.2 (talk) 17:12, 18 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Discrepancies between White House versions and Federal Register versions

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Every source I find is just a copy of USA Today's report. I'm not saying USA Today is a bad source, I just wish I could find more sources. - Kiraroshi1976 (talk) 00:25, 15 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Presidential Sequestration Order

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I've just cleaned up some wording regarding the President's ability to issue a "Presidential Sequestration Order", but I have no idea what this actually is. Do we have an article on this type of order that we can wikilink to? Lankiveil (speak to me) 11:24, 6 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Lankiveil:: I believe this is what you are looking for: Budget sequestration. - Kiraroshi1976 (talk) 02:51, 18 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]
@Kiraroshi1976: Thanks for that. I'm still a little in the dark as to what the machinery of government actually is. Does the President issue a special sort of order (called a sequestration order) to invoke budget sequestration, and is this a legally distinct mechanism from other sorts of executive order? Lankiveil (speak to me) 08:56, 18 June 2017 (UTC).[reply]
@Lankiveil:: Not exactly like an executive order. However, Obama did it in 2016. Also look at United States budget sequestration in 2013. Also see Austerity. - Kiraroshi1976 (talk) 02:25, 19 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Cuba memorandum

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Is there a reason why the National Security Presidential Memorandum on Strengthening the Policy of the United States Toward Cuba has not been added here yet, or is it supposed to be here but hasn't yet for whatever reason? --1990'sguy (talk) 17:21, 18 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Should be in there; please go ahead. — JFG talk 23:02, 18 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]
I did not get to it. Sorry. - Kiraroshi1976 (talk) 02:26, 19 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]
I updated the list for 2 memos. - Kiraroshi1976 (talk) 03:29, 19 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]

National Day for the Victims of Communism

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I see that the White House recognized the National Day for the Victims of Communism. However, I see that it is not listed here. Does it not count as a proclamation? --1990'sguy (talk) 20:11, 11 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@1990'sguy: I found it in the Statements & Releases section. If by chance it is added to the Federl Register, I'll add it to the list. - Kiraroshi1976 (talk) 22:26, 26 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Propose a split of the Proclamations and the executive orders

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Hello, I would like to propose a split of the Proclamations and the executive orders to new pages and have the Donald Trump series to where there will be "Executive actions (Executive orders * Proclamations)" since there is a hidden category: Category:Pages where template include size is exceeded. I'd be willing make those pages and update the Executive actions page and the DT series.- Kiraroshi1976 (talk) 03:31, 14 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Hello, I went ahead and split the proclamations page and executive actions to prevent further problems with the page it was beginning to be too big. - Kiraroshi1976 (talk) 04:34, 5 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]
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Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 14 external links on List of executive actions by Donald Trump. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

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I fixed the links so that they were correct since the dates were not correct for archival. - Kiraroshi1976 (talk) 04:35, 5 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

National Guard memorandum

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I would expect the Federal Register to publish Trump's memo ordering the National Guard to the southern border. However, the Federal Register hasn't published it (AFAIK) despite having published more recent executive actions. Is there a reason for this, and will it be added to this article? --1990'sguy (talk) 03:15, 15 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

possible misreporting on Executive Orders

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At https://www.ksnt.com/news/trump-signs-executive-order-denying-asylum-to-illegal-border-crossers/1583103353 Colleen Long of Associated Press via ksnt.com reported November 9 on Trump signing an EO, but it still hasn't shown up in https://www.federalregister.gov/executive-order/13851 or https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/ as of now.

Is it possible this is classified as something else and Long got the category wrong? Like a Memoranda or Determination or Proclamation? Or an Order or a Notice? If that is the case and it has been issued/announced I'd like to find and include it.

In cases where we have proof that media have been reporting something in the wrong category, I'm wondering if we could make a footnote in the wrongly alleged category linking to an anchor for the proper section which details it. Ash Carol (talk) 06:10, 12 November 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Graph

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Are there any objections to removing the incomplete graph from the top of this list article? It doesn't cover the entire time period in the article and i don't think it helps with understanding the totality of the executive actions. Liz Read! Talk! 17:37, 20 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for speedy deletion

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The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for speedy deletion:

You can see the reason for deletion at the file description page linked above. —Community Tech bot (talk) 16:06, 4 September 2019 (UTC)[reply]

A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion

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The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion:

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How many of these were overturned?

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It would be nice to add a column saying which were partially or mostly or completely overturned by courts. For instance 13795 was overturned- but I don't know what fraction... An answer on Quora said as of May 21, 2019 there were 37 Nationwide Injunctions issued against Donald Trump. But it didn't say which orders they were for... An interesting search: how many injunctions against trump executive orders — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2600:1700:3ec0:ae30:f1bc:4c03:301e:9fd3 (talk) 17:52, 24 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Do any other 'List of executive actions' pages follow this standard of a revocation column? It feels like a hard statistic to track, and likely one that is not always noted/reported. --Engineerchange (talk) 14:45, 22 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Executive orders are sometimes revoked by presidents too. Many of Trump's have been revoked by Biden. It would be useful to have a column on these articles (not just for Trump) – something like "Revoked by", which would be filled by either N/A or the executive order number that revoked it. MClay1 (talk) 04:26, 12 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Incorrect archive changes

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User:Reywas92 generated a whole lot of https://trumpwhitehouse.archives.gov/the-press-office/2017/01/2/executive-order-minimizing-economic-burden-patient-protection-and links that do not work. REAL archives do exist at https://web.archive.org/web/*/https://whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2017/01/2/executive-order-minimizing-economic-burden-patient-protection-and AManWithNoPlan (talk) 18:00, 14 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

  • All of the prior links did not work because they died when whitehouse.gov was archived. My spotchecking showed the large majority of changes to trumpwhitehouse.archives.gov did work but I see that a number still didn't go to the right page and I'm not sure why. I have returned all urls tagged as dead to their original dead url that would be on archive.org. Reywas92Talk 18:47, 14 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
@Reywas92: For what it's worth, looking at a few of them on archive.org, it appears some were likely not even working when the transition happened to trumpwhitehouse.archives.gov, but are still available as archives to the original whitehouse.gov address. Engineerchange (talk) 20:57, 14 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
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